Round 6 Zolder - Thu Dec 10, 2020

A great fight in the last rounds of Toni and Jos.
Toni, you should have caught Jos, we need to do a Lancia tutorial sometime.

Congratulations to the podium and the winners of the championship, thanks to John for organizing and running the DRM REVIVAL event.

 

Thanks Tim. I'll take the advice onboard. The slow-in fast-out approach is something I picked up ages ago and helped me improve speed in rF1 along with learning a bit about setting the car up. But maybe some old habits have crept back in. I'll try and follow your advice. Cheers

 

I didn't finnish to read all the posts yet but I wanted to add one thing I forgot : Sorry guys I parked my car in that last race due to several reasons, the main being that I had completely forgotten to take off some clothes before the start of the race so that it was a bit too much warmed here after a few laps.. Also I am worrying about my wheel which smell burned plastic or something since a couple days after a PC reboot ! Add to that Filip was about to lap me and as I was thinking about retiring I did it at this moment before possibly being a mobile big cone on the track for him.

 

Thanks Matteo. Think I'm better in rF2 than AC. I'm really relatively new to AC. The GPL series we had a while back was my first online race with it so I'm still learning. I'll take onboard what you've both said and hopefully close the gap a little bit more in the next series. Think I am progressing with each series.

 

And a massive thanks to you and your team for making the Mod - I'm just sorry I didn't try it out sooner!

 

Starting by my previous reasonings, I just guessed a possible way to modify your pointing system as follows:
Pos. Points
1 50
2 40
3 34
4 30
5 27
6 24
7 22
8 20
9 18
10 16
11 14
12 12
13 10
14 9
15 8
16 7
17 6
18 5
19 4
20 3
21 2
22 1


It's not so different, as you can see, by your actual pointing system, but a bit more rewarding for victory. The first 22 drivers would be able to take points
So, if you do 5 victory on 6 races with only 1 DNF, you'd still able to keep the lead against a 6 time finisher in 2nd position.

Edited after I read Mark Hightree post about the DNF issue. However, even if there's no chance about the DNF getting no points, that would be a little be less rewarding for the DNF, if compared to your previous system. It's a matter of proportions. Example:
I finished DNF in 10th position. With your actual pointing system I took 18 points. That means I took 45% of the points of Filip, that won the race. With my system, in 10th position, I'd have collect only 16 points, and Filip 50. So only the 32% of the leader points. That would work a bit better IMO.

 

To me, someone should have completed at least 50% of a race distance to gain any points from a DNF, and even that is generous in my humble opinion. Probably should be more like 75%. Same as points gaps, You want to encourage guys to give it their all for the whole race distance after all, not pull into the pits and retire early or think they only miss out on a couple of points by driving like miss daisy until the flag

 

Ah, don't worry that much. As far as my speed and if it would come to rF2 for example, you can forget me. I didn't start rF2 more than 4-5 times in my life for a couple of hours altogether. AC is the only sim I drove since I started simracing again in 2019. And I am doing a bit of ACC this year, but had only a few online races through the lobby. Mostly doing practice sessions with some mates. Trying to see what's what with those cars and to try and get up to speed with them. I think ACC is well improved in terms of physics and driving feel somewhat better than AC, even now after so much AC community support. But GT3/GT4 only is not my idea of 100% fun in simracing. It's more these open platforms such as rF2 and AC.

As I said before, it's only laps and laps which helped me get better and better. And these races you've had. Setups come second. Learn a particular car's RPM range for torque and HP and also their peaks. The Ferrari is heavy but still nimble enough, somewhere in between the Porsche and the Capri. But horsepower is huge, although with slightly less top speed than with the Porsche or M1. Turn on speed/rpm and delta time apps and see where you loose or gain time with just driving a default setup. It will take 2-3 laps for brakes and tires to be warm and at 100%. Then start looking for optimal braking points, lines and how much speed you can carry through. During that run, you can decide what kind of gear changes you might need if something with the default ones is wrong around the track. Try to find the shortest final gear possible with tweaking on the gears themselves for the speeds you need. Now you can already realize a kind of a pattern for what's good and what's not good in that car (it won't pull in this gear at this RPM) and on that particular track (not grippy here, but yes grippy there). But don't change yet anything with the setup. Search with delta laptime display for places and moments where you actually see that you can still gain something. There's always some tenths hidden but it's hard if you're still struggling with the car. I also mentioned before that I used the Sidekick app which has all important info in one app, much better than default Essential apps. For example you can see brake temps there and see if you have problems with overheating, not enough heat etc. Which certainly helped me while making a race setup for Zolder to be able to recognize when I might end up in trouble. One or two hard on the brakes moments, and I knew I'll be locking up rear wheels at the next hard braking point. The front brakes overheat and start to fade, while at the same time the rears are in optimum temp then and will grab the rear wheels. All in a second. Pretty common problem with the BMW 320i turbo. Oh, and not to forget tires. The rears overheat easily. It's another part of the game, or next level, to either go with the setup and adjust driving a bit, or completely change the setup for reducing heat build up into those tires. But that comes after you've squeezed enough from just driving the car as it is, with default setup.

 

Thanks, Dennis. A great mod that has given me (and hopefully will continue to give) much enjoyment over this series and before. Congratulations to the development team.

The Lancias are very fast all around. They've had the upper hand almost in all tracks, only challenged properly by the BMWs, although I acknowledge the Escorts can also be fast (in the right hands... as Filip showed us). Do you have any developer benchmark of how they perform against each other?
Another curiosity I've always had with this mod in comparison with the DRM mod in rFactor/AMS, is the engines' resilience to blow up when revved. In AMS, if you are not extraordinarily careful with the throttle, the engine is gone in no time, but cars seem to be significantly more resistant here. Is that an issue with AC or AMS? What's more realistic behavior? Thanks.

 

You were pretty fast with the Daytona Paul, if I remember correctly. I agree, some sims can take speed out of you until you get used to.

 

We are going to have to look at this wheel, Maxime. It sounds worrying. Perhaps it's about time to look into DDs?
I have a fan in the cockpit but having the right level of clothing (just a t-shirt most of the time) is essential in these races. The level of body overheating after a good fight is unbelievable. Don't think we lose 3 litres like F1 drivers but at least 300ml dissipated yesterday after the fight with Toni

 

Oh dear, I sure whould like to, but I just can't resonnably put 1k on the table for this at the moment. So as long as this T500RS will last I will keep it and talk very kindly to it, and be stroking it after every session...

 

The Lancia and the new 320 BMW are DIV1.65.
If you compare the lap times in 1980 of the Div 2 to the Div 1 of 1979, then the Div2 cars were e.g. in Hockenheim only 1.5 sec slower.
The 79 Lancia beat the 935 in the WRC in 1979, not by maximum power, but because they were very fast everywhere on every track. Not for winners but for top positions
Like in Assetto Corsa. I would have liked to prove it, but many things didn't go as well for me in the championship as I thought. Too bad, many accidents and unnecessary discussions, but that's another topic.
The engines also break very quickly in Assetto Corsa, as long as the damage is set to 100%. But we have reduced the "self-destruction" of the engines a bit, so as not to cause frustration. The cars are hard to drive by themselves, so if the engine blows up after 4 laps, that could discourage many from driving.
I think the engine in rf1 is more realistic about the engines.
For the AMS version I can not make any statement, the MOD has not been converted by us for AMS.

I'm glad you enjoyed the season.

BTW: We built the Escort in AC as an underdog, in the right hand a damn fast vehicle. You showed that brilliantly over the season !!!!!

 

Very informative Dennis. Thanks!

You certainly had a brutal pace on the Lancia on the races you did. With better luck I don't think you would have been at reach for the rest of the competition... Perhaps @Kiril Kirilov had he also had better luck.

I understand the standard simracer doesn't respond well to very challenging mods with realistic engine damage, etc. To be honest, there are days that nobody is really up to engine blowings at the minimum mistake but I find it really appealing when focusing on a mod and working through all its challenges, so well done on the realistic approach. As you say, you can always reduce the damage if you wish.

Very kind words Dennis. Much appreciated. I did my best but a lot still to improve for the next series with this mod that I hope it's not too long from now.

 

I see no problem with the point system scale, it keeps the field compact and often close points on the podium. However the DNF should mimic real life, if not 75% at least 50% laps driven of the leader to get points.

 

I guess that if @John vd Geest agree would be nice to put up a poll on this subject. It's not a matter if people is not interested in changing your actual system, but I believe that an attempt can be done. I could prepare any different pointing system in 10 mins. It's simple mathematics. It's just a matter of proportions between the points of the leader and the rest of the field.

My intention was that of underline that with your actual scoring system on a 6 race championship, it's possible, to make another example, to win a champ for a driver that is never gone on a podium. A driver that win 4 races and collect 160 points without joining a couple of races, would be beaten by a driver that has collected 6 times the points for the 5th place (28 x 6 = 168). This would never happen in any motorsport champ scoring system in real life.
I understand every point of view about keeping the field compact, but it's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of fact. The actual scoring system favours ONLY people who join races, without any regard to the performance or merit for a driver that in real life would have won a champ, even without joining a couple of races.

The question is simple: do you want to reward more the dirver that takes risk to gain a victory? Or you just want that everybody has a chance to win a championship even with "poor" results?
I'd give more weight to the merit than to the constance in joining races. But that's just my point of view. Can we now open a poll?

 

I think that it's great way to keep grids bigger, in real life drivers won't escape from series just after couple races if they are not fast enough...

 

True... but a driver that make this axxhole reasoning wouldn' be a great loss for the portal. Or at least I wouldn't consider it so. It's better to race against few normal drivers, or people that can accept to be slower, that with a bunch of axxholes