rFactor 2 Round 2 Red Bull Ring - Sun Jul 9, 2023

Discussion in 'S397 Porsche GT3 Cup 992 European Champ Closed' started by John vd Geest, May 25, 2023.

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  1. John vd Geest

    John vd Geest Administrator Staff Member Donator

    [​IMG]

    Drivers briefing

    1. All 6 events of this series will be broadcasted

    Broadcaster: Rob Milliken
    Broadcast channel: SimRacingOnline

    2. Red Bull Ring event Conditions
    1) The race will start at 02:00 PM (in-game time of course)
    2) Time acceleration is normal. Fuel and Tires are set to normal.
    3) Cut Track points are set to 10
    4) 100% damage
    5) There is no mandatory pitstop
    6) This event has a Formation lap with standing start
    7) The duration of the race is 60 minutes

    3. Raceday weather conditions
    The server is set for real-world weather conditions as they are today July 9 in Spielberg.
    See post #40

    4. Qualification procedure
    1) The Qual time will be 15 minutes in total.
    2) Chat is not allowed during Qual.

    5. The use of the Esc. key in Qualification
    Use of the Esc key during Qualifying is the equivalent of stopping your car and getting out. This may be done only in your pit stall. There are very few exceptions to this rule. Here are the only two we will currently consider. These exceptions are subject to change at any time:
    1. You run out of fuel in pit lane before reaching your pit stall.
    2. You sustain damage to your car as a result of another driver and cannot make it back to your pit stall. You must prove your qualifying session was wrecked by another driver and that you made an attempt to return to pit lane.

    If you use the Esc key in any location other than your pit stall, your Qualifying session is over and you may not return to the track.

    6. You can find the password for the race server on the Red Bull Ring event page.

    7. You can find the server by first typing sro

    8. Unregistering in time if you can't make it.

    9. No-shows (keeping the entry list real)
    If a driver does not show without unregistering for that event or letting us know that he can't make it on the event forum, he will be removed from the series.
    If he is no longer interested in the series, it's fine like it is.
    If he forgot about the event, he can sign up for the series again.

    (You don't have to unregister for the whole series. You can unregister only for the event you can't do.)

    10. Please use the same name in the rFactor 2 game as on our signup list or it won't match in our automated result processing.

    11. If you plan to PROTEST another driver, you have to wait 24 hours counting from the end of the race.
    Any protest filed before that time will be viewed as not received. You can find the rules about submitting a protest here.

    Last but not least ... SIMRACINGONLINE wishes you a great race!

    ***************************************************

    If you have questions, please ask them below.
     
    John vd Geest, Jul 8, 2023
    #41
  2. Kahel Grahf

    Kahel Grahf Pro Driver

    Let me preface this with a little disclaimer... I get that the decision of no track limit for this track come from a good place... and I don't really have a solution other than coming to an understanding between drivers...
    But, the way the ruling is now will be problematic imo...

    Right now, I'm on server, testing my lap time doing normal lap VS what the track limit allow (which are insane limit, there is almost none)
    Lap time difference is more than 1s... and that's pretty much first lap, without any practicing.

    By itself the line we are allow to take are already ugly enough... but couple that with the fact that we can't overtake (outside the white line, against guys that are allow to race there)... and it make things even worst.

    Means... some (that don't like this kind of driving) might be against guys that already goes 1s faster...
    But even if 2 guys going for the 'free limit rule' manage to catch each others... they won't be able to battle, overtake, since we would be offtrack most of the time where it count.

    Basically means almost no overtaking allowed... and there will be 2 race at the same time... between the ones that goes crazy with track limit and the others.

    Right now I'd like to practice... I don't know what to do... :confused: practice crazy line or not?

    PS: I don't mind either way... it's all good and fun at the end of the day... just feel like it's part of the enjoyement to race against like minded driver... and right now praticing the 'insane' line is kind of no fun... and will for sure be interpreted has illegal driving by most (myself including)
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2023
    Kahel Grahf, Jul 9, 2023
    #42
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Kiril Kirilov

    Kiril Kirilov Pro Driver

    No track limits will do the same. The track limit warnings on this track model is totaly broken. @Kahel Grahf is totaly right. This one will look very ugly on the stream. We shouldn't have made an exception here, especially because of this broken track model.
     
    Kiril Kirilov, Jul 9, 2023
    #43
    • Agree Agree x 2
  4. Barrett Erickson

    Barrett Erickson Pro Driver

    "No, that would constitute total anarchy :).

    "This "no track limit exception" only applies to 1 car drifting too much over the line or driving too much inside the corner on the apex.
    If we allow 2 or more cars to fight for position outside the track limits, then we could just as well abolish civilization. :eek:
    If you are overtaken outside the track limits (unless there is an accident situation etc.), then you have grounds for protest."

    Thanks for that, John. I had visions of that... what was it... an IMSA race? at COTA a few years ago where everyone was going 80-90 feet wide at the exit of the penultimate corner because the stewards announced they weren't going to enforce track limits there. What a farce. Couldn't even watch it after a few laps.

    So basically, what you're saying is, it shouldn't be your chosen line?
     
    Barrett Erickson, Jul 9, 2023
    #44
    • Like Like x 2
  5. Kahel Grahf

    Kahel Grahf Pro Driver

    The thing is... I was only wondering because I saw someone on the server practicing very weird, extreme lines.

    So that's at least one... and I don't blame him, quiet the opposite. I'll hate for him to be bashed on stream and by other driver, when he was only following the rules (to the letter).

    Now, just saw that John added some insight to the ruling... but how many missed it... and how many don't even know about the 'free' track rule in the first place and will find out at the last minute...
     
    Kahel Grahf, Jul 9, 2023
    #45
  6. Toni Talvitie

    Toni Talvitie Pro Driver Donator

    well, its been ruled. ill try to stick with lines nevertheless. probably wide somelaps and somelaps not.
     
    Toni Talvitie, Jul 9, 2023
    #46
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. John vd Geest

    John vd Geest Administrator Staff Member Donator

    The purpose of the no track limit exception is to have a level playing field and to give "everybody" the same opportunity for a fast lap time. Not just the guys who will take full advantage of the possibility to cut.
    I fully understand that you want people to play by the rules and so do I, but it will give a lot of controversy after the race between people who play "fair" and people who cut.
    If we enforce track limits for this track, there will be a complete "sh*t storm" post-race and fights on the forum, not to speak of the record breaking filed protests.
    Believe me, this is the best way to forward. There is no way that everybody will play fair and this solves all problems before they start.

    I promise you that I will be more careful reviewing track limits on tracks in the future. Lesson learned :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2023
    John vd Geest, Jul 9, 2023
    #47
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Andreas Seibel

    Andreas Seibel Pro Driver Donator

    After reading latest comments I am even more confused how to behave. I will try to stay between the lines, knowing that you can gain 0,5 to 1 sec at T1. I dont care about my position, lets make it a gentleman agreement that in case you gain time, go off the throttle to give back your "illegal" advantage.
     
    Andreas Seibel, Jul 9, 2023
    #48
    • Like Like x 1
  9. John vd Geest

    John vd Geest Administrator Staff Member Donator

    No need to be confused. This is the agreement we have for this event:
    1. Track limits are given free if you happen to drift outside the white line, because of the reasons given above.
    2. You are not allowed to overtake outside the White line.

    My apologies for selecting this track version. After this event, it will not be used again. :)
     
    John vd Geest, Jul 9, 2023
    #49
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. Kahel Grahf

    Kahel Grahf Pro Driver

    Dont think it's an issue with the track choice... it doesn't help for sure... but we did play rf2 for YEARS before the automated system was implemented... with little issues.
    (I'm surprise you think this way... make me think I'm missing something... you have so much more experience in organizing events... But, beside that fact, one thing for sure, it made some of us very confused)

    The ironie in this... probably would have been an non-issue if nothing was change with the ruling...
    We would have done like always... keep the track limit in mind but manage pushing the car... with the risk of protest if we make too many mistakes...

    But like toni said, it's done...
    Right now... I'm still under the impression that a few driver will cut as much as the track allow... so I'll have to do the same... at first...
    And go from there...

    It will look awful... and I know it will be seen as a 'douchebag' move... I'm afraid that the way to go unfortunately...
    and next time a track is problematic, I feel like post-automated ruling should apply... WAYYYYY less confusing... imo
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2023
    Kahel Grahf, Jul 9, 2023
    #50
    • Like Like x 3
  11. Gilles Villeneuve

    Gilles Villeneuve Pro Driver

    I got this error. But I have both track and car
     
    Gilles Villeneuve, Jul 9, 2023
    #51
  12. Gilles Villeneuve

    Gilles Villeneuve Pro Driver

    This is the Mog manager error upload_2023-7-9_14-4-39.png
     
    Gilles Villeneuve, Jul 9, 2023
    #52
  13. Gilles Villeneuve

    Gilles Villeneuve Pro Driver

    upload_2023-7-9_14-5-58.png
     
    Gilles Villeneuve, Jul 9, 2023
    #53
  14. John vd Geest

    John vd Geest Administrator Staff Member Donator

    You also have to subscribe to the skin pack on the event page. We are all driving with that.
     
    John vd Geest, Jul 9, 2023
    #54
  15. Gilles Villeneuve

    Gilles Villeneuve Pro Driver

    Ok solved it. Deleted and Reinstalled the skin pack fix it. Sorry
     
    Gilles Villeneuve, Jul 9, 2023
    #55
    • Like Like x 1
  16. John vd Geest

    John vd Geest Administrator Staff Member Donator

    Ships ... 10 minutes before the end I scrubbed the wall on turn 1 and bend my steering. Luckely I was still able to continue and keep 6 place ...
    But this race was a lot of fun with some pretty good fights for me. On to Silverstone ...
     
    John vd Geest, Jul 9, 2023
    #56
    • Like Like x 3
  17. Andreas Seibel

    Andreas Seibel Pro Driver Donator

    Sorry Kai (I guess it was you who crashed into me) - I wanted to attack John in front of me and took too much risk in T1 and spun - unfortunately I think you saw me too late
     
    Andreas Seibel, Jul 9, 2023
    #57
    • Sportsmanship Sportsmanship x 1
  18. Johnny Gutierrez

    Johnny Gutierrez Pro Driver

    Good racing guys. I'm from the old school. No cutting. If a car cuts and passes me, it is what it is. Can't do much about it but have fun. Didn't happen this time. When there was cuts, the person behind would decide not to pass me. That's the old regulating your self system of having a good race.

    Other than my tires being made out of butter, it was a good race. Good launch at the start and being taken out by a back marker that did not want to let me pass, even when doing a complete lap with him. Toni probably had a good laugh watching this. But still good racing overall.

    What's up with the braking? My engine would sometimes cut out and have no drive. Weird. It braked like my friends POS Nissan.

    Cheers,

    Johnny
     
    Johnny Gutierrez, Jul 9, 2023
    #58
    • Like Like x 2
    • Funny Funny x 1
  19. Eugene Mazur

    Eugene Mazur Pro Driver

    Johnny, that was me I guess. I was about to lift after that last corner and let you guys pass, instead I spun. My apologies.
     
    Eugene Mazur, Jul 9, 2023
    #59
    • Like Like x 2
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  20. Lorne Martin

    Lorne Martin Pro Driver

    Had a few lag issues that put me in the wall. It’s like when it happens you just try in your mind to make the corner and figure out where you are when the lag stops. Still working on that one lol. Still learning for me and it’s not easy but not giving up. I hope I didn’t cause any problems for anybody. Thanks for the race gentleman
     
    Lorne Martin, Jul 9, 2023
    #60
    • Like Like x 1
    • Sportsmanship Sportsmanship x 1
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
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